SPEAKER_00 0:00

Why be traditional when you could be different? Because I've learned over the years as a business owner, is it's like when you first get started, you're like, yeah, I'll work with anyone and everyone.

SPEAKER_01 0:06

And not everybody's gonna be interested in what you do.

SPEAKER_00 0:08

Following your passions, your dreams, your aspirations, doing something that lights you up every single day.

SPEAKER_01 0:12

Are you seeing that there is higher value to being almost like more entertaining today?

SPEAKER_00 0:18

Hosting consistently as your customers feel more connected to you.

SPEAKER_01 0:21

Once you become interesting to people, then they become interested in what you do.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

It's crazy how things have shifted from paying for leads and all the things to now this like parasocial relationship building stuff.

SPEAKER_01 0:33

What's up, everybody? Grantwise. Welcome back to the Partner and Profit Podcast. And I'm excited for my conversation today. I've got Norman Kinsey on the show, and we're gonna dive into all things partnership, relationship, business, etc. Norman, man, thanks for spending some time with me today.

SPEAKER_00 0:48

Yeah, most definitely, man. I was actually traveling on, well, I was traveling to the last one before last of going to California, and you sent me that message on Facebook. And I was like, oh man, Grant, I haven't talked to you in years. And so very honored, dude, to have the opportunity to be on the other end as a guest of a podcast. But thanks so much, man.

SPEAKER_01 1:07

Of course, yeah. I'm grateful that we could spend some time together. I remember being on your show. I think you've been on a couple of times, maybe, uh, but it's been a few years. So I'm glad we're catching up here and and uh gonna add some value to the audience today. So for people that are listening to this, maybe don't know much about you, give us a little bit of the backstory. How'd you get to where you are today?

SPEAKER_00 1:24

Yeah, most definitely. So uh basically in my apartment and I was in my 20s, 22, 23, banging my head against the wall, wanted to be of service to an industry, had no idea what that looked like. So then I found a boutique brokerage called J. Rockcliffe Realtors, called 350 agents and said, tell me about your business. I didn't want to sell them on anything, I just wanted to understand what they're going through. And they said they want to be different from their colleagues, they want control from broker to broker, and they want the same support as a top-performing real estate professional. So I said, hmm, okay, there's something here. Met my partner Smith Chung. He used to work at Google on a project that we both partnered on. I had all these weird in and out type of odd jobs. And so one of them was building a brochure for the ambassador of Livyon, uh, which is super weird, but they were doing a gala or something and they needed a brochure. And a friend of mine, she was working at a credit union, and the branch manager needed this done. And she's like, Man, I don't know, Norman, like this guy, he's always just know someone or whatever else. So I took it on, uh went on Craigslist and did a post and met Smith. And then he was uh he's working at Google A U U X, that's his degree, and he was working on the Google Plus project when that was a thing. I don't want to date myself, but when that was a thing. And then fast forward, uh, he built websites. So then we said, okay, like we did the social media brand thing, let's get into websites. And then from there, about two years ago, we started to get into this whole passive prospecting thing. So now we partner with like Levi Lasik and Travis. Um, that's gonna be passive prospecting. If you know, um, if you know channel junkies, Jesse and Jackson, if you know Mile High Property Brothers, legit agent Willem Eli, um, and a bunch of coaches now across the country that does this passive prospecting with YouTube. So now we got into full-scale YouTube editing. So in that time frame, met 16,000 plus agents to really understand what they're going through. Um, have almost 500 agents across the country, uh, just shy of 20 on staff. And we help agents either start, ramp, and scale their business, depending on if they just need a website, branding, positioning, to getting into ramp up to now getting a little bit into YouTube, listening promotion and running some retargeting ads to the full-on video to blog and what have you on the on the highest level. And the highest level, our client last year, Zach Central Texas, did about $35 million as a solo agent with YouTube passive prospecting and his website.

SPEAKER_01 3:46

That's incredible.

SPEAKER_00 3:47

Yeah, it's amazing stuff, man. That's amazing stuff. And it's crazy how things have shifted from paying for leads and all the things to now this like parasocial relationship building stuff. It's like, what?

SPEAKER_01 3:57

Yeah, I mean, I think um who was it? Oh, Gary Vaynerchalk. Uh I heard him say this a few years ago. He's like, you're gonna reach a period of time where the barrier to entry to business will be being a media company, which is i.e. creating video content, social media, etc. And I think we've been there for a minute. And um it's it's so true. Like that was uh that was a prophecy. He definitely was at the end of the day. It's hard to break into the business space because you gotta have an audience.

SPEAKER_00 4:25

Yeah, and and I think there's something to be said about customer retention and um and people building you know relationships with you, and like I have a lot of clients that follow and watch the stories and see what's going on. And I just randomly started doing vlogging again with these trips that I'm doing, and I'm putting it out there on YouTube just for fun, just for fun, and then like this year podcast, which is helps so much for people to be like, oh, this is what he's up to, this is what he's doing, and hopefully try to keep inspiring others.

SPEAKER_01 4:52

So, when you think about building relationships today, do you do you find yourself spending more time creating those one-to-one, or or is it more one-to-many through social?

SPEAKER_00 5:03

A little bit of both. So, one-to-one from the podcast perspective is always amazing. And because I have this in-person podcast studio, I've been inviting more people over to my personal residence, and my my wife's a full-time entrepreneur as well. So she she takes care of us on the tea, and we have some tea time and we we pot out and we have some fun. The last agent that I had, you know, it was like a one-to-one, and I was gonna reschedule it for the second time. And she's like, if you don't show, like, if we can't do this, I'm already out front, like this isn't gonna work. And I was like two weeks, no break, and I was just exhausted, but I got through it. And by the end of the podcast, she's like, So tell me about the sponsor. What's this lift-off agent thing? And then now she's she's being a custom website with us, and that's a $5,000 close. And so that was on accident. I didn't even try to do that, but that was like a one-to-one in my personal residence, like coming to my location, and it worked out really well. One to many is doing really well with this social content from the perspective I've been doing a lot with car stuff. And so I took my wife out to just a date, and we were getting on the freeway. And if you're a car person, when you're you're doing a tunnel run or you're getting on the freeway, like that's a good time to like do a pool. So I did this pool on the freeway, and uh the video caught wind, and it's I think at 160,000 views, and it hasn't stopped getting additional attention. Um, reaching over 300,000 people on my personal just Instagram account, and that has nothing to do with marketing, nothing to do with the real estate side. It's just being a human being and putting out my passions. Um, and that's a little bit more one to many, and then people that are are filtering through that are then sending me DMs or interested about, hey, how do I work with you? What's this lift-off agent thing? And so it's just starting to spike more conversations. I would say that uh high value one-to-one is is it's almost priceless, and then one to many, you have to kind of go through the weeds and find maybe maybe the top 1% that actually you're gonna be able to transact with or do something with.

SPEAKER_01 7:02

I asked this question to somebody the other day, and I think it's fitting to ask you, is is it hard to have a relationship with, I think you said like 300,000 people, is it is it hard to have a relationship with that many people at one time? Or does social media make it pretty easy?

SPEAKER_00 7:15

Uh yeah, yes, yes and no. So I've done I've done some analyzation, and the people from the perspective of just Instagram, you have certain people like a demographic that watch your story, and that could be a few hundred people that go deeper into wanting to understand your story, what you're up to, and what you're doing. And then I've been seeing a life cycle of viewership. So, say for instance, if it comes into like a Sunday to a Monday, you'll get like a huge spike, and people will then check out your content, see what's going on. Sundays, I always like don't post. And so that's my family time, I don't do any social media, I just let everything reset. And then that's one demographic. Now you have say short form. Short form, I got like one to many from that 150, 160,000 views, and then you have all these comments, but they kind of like take a life of their own. And then from there, you also have say um like other content. Like if I do like a head top type conversation, I'm only getting maybe two to three to four to five hundred views. So it's almost like I could see like there's about a bracket of people that maybe could be like a 0.5% of maybe 150,000 views, they're like 500, we'll say, they're like watching you more intimately to see what you're doing from the short form content type of stuff, and that feed over into like stories. But just because I'm getting 150, 160,000 views on a short form does not equate to them wanting to go to my stories to learn more because it's just like brain rot when there's just you know, three seconds, three seconds, three seconds. And so I'm grateful that I got that three second, but that's pretty much all it was.

SPEAKER_01 8:41

It it's fascinating, and we've just reached a period of time where you're you know anybody can have a relationship one to many. Um I think it is a little harder, you know, go back to this concept of being a media company. Like, you do have to create content, you've got to create it consistently, you've got to stay in the front of people. But um it's it's such an amazing way to grow a business compared to doing it one-to-one. I have a lot of uh incredible conversations one-on-one doing it right now, right? Like this is um it's a fun part of a business, but being able to kind of like crack the code on going one-to-many is one of the ultimate business hacks. And uh I love it. It's very interesting to me. I I always love doing the car stuff. Anyone that knows me knows that uh I want the G-Wagon. I've been uh it's one I've wanted for a long time. I've just always reinvested my money back into business, but I'm nearing a point where I'll be able to get one. So I'll be able to graduate from the model that I carry around with me at all times to uh but anytime I post about like just a picture of a G-Wagon, my my audience seems to have a crazy reaction to it too. So I'm really excited to actually get it because I uh I'm fascinated to see what happens socially with uh the audience.

SPEAKER_00 9:48

That's amazing. I absolutely love that. Yeah, it was like uh two and a half, almost three years ago, got the GTR after a tenure goal. Um, and I you know had like my child first and then put her through private school, then now she's in public school at a charter, and then my wife, she was working full-time, and so you know, buy the house, take care of the daughter, take care of the wife. She's not working not anymore, and then we did some house hacking here with our current residents that afforded us to be able to say, hey, this is actually self-sufficient. So then being able to purchase that, and then um that actually has worked really well with then now what I'm doing from the perspective of now I've kind of rebranded to like Mr. Liftoff. So it's like liftoff agent, Mr. Liftoff, and then I have this whole new like lift off experience podcast. So it's it's turning into something so much more because even with the GTR, it has launch mode. And so that is like, are you ready for liftoffs? I joke with people when I go on with they take them for rides, like you ready to lift off? And then I've had some videos like hit hundreds of thousands with that, and then the TRX that I purchased two years ago that also has launch mode, and so that's almost 800 horsepower, and it's only like a second slower than the GTR, which is like 700 and something horsepower, and so it's like 2.5 and like 3.5 second difference. And uh, so it was funny. I was actually my neighbor, we were looking at a potential flip. My wife and I got out of this, and she was going to drink, and I didn't preface and I said, You ready for liftoff? And I hit it on the freeway entrance, and she like totally spilt like stuff all over her, and I was like, So sorry, Ashley. And she's like, You had to warn me, blah, blah, blah. I'm like, Oh, so sorry. So so now it's turning into this like different kind of way to brand yourself with an experience with a vehicle, which is very interesting, but it's pretty cool, man. It's it's pretty cool the people that you can reach. And uh this weekend we're doing a show for a kid that God bless he he passed he passed and he was in high school, and I had to reach out to me and he's like, Hey, can you come and bring some of the people? And our last event was the first of January. We had about 50 people here at the house and about 39 cars. I had about five million dollars in cars, and we did this whole thing, and um and it was just it's interesting. So now if I ever post about anything, because I don't do it that often as far as my events, I do two a year, like my story or my my reel gets posted in all these stories from all the guys that are in the community because it's just it's a different type of family. It's like you just if you're a car person, you just know, and it sounds like your audience they they want the G Wagon.

SPEAKER_01 12:15

You know, I work a lot in real estate and home services, and a lot of those people tend to be entrepreneurs or salespeople. And a lot of the entrepreneurs and salespeople I've always met have like wanted something like that. They're always seem to be working towards it, which is which is cool. I've been talking about this for a while now, so people have I get I get harassed at this point. Like, when are you gonna buy the D-Wagon? We know that you can afford it, like what are you doing? And I'm like, nah, I don't deserve it yet. I gotta I got some goals to hit, I gotta, I got some more things to do. But it's it's interesting to me because when you talk about developing relationships, people are like, well, what do cars have to do with that? And I think that it sounds like you found that your audience resonates with cars and you like cars. Is there is there a correlation there? Is that is are those things connected?

SPEAKER_00 13:00

Yeah, most definitely for sure. Whether it's like fitness, cars, healthy lifestyle, it all can is encompassing. So, like, say I went and I was just like, all right, I'm gonna go. Cool thing about a car too is like you work really hard, you hit those goals that you have, and then you're like, all right, like I'm gonna go take a drive. So you're like, go take a drive, and it's just like, yes, I can experience this thing that I work so hard to now own and have and achieve. So I went to this parking garage and I go to the top, and I'm just like, all right, I'm gonna take some videos, what have you. It was a Thursday afternoon, beautiful day here in Arizona. And then I had um a couple people come up, younger guys in their 20s, and they see the car and oh, can I sit in it? Can I take pictures and whatever else? And like that's the best part about it now, is sharing it. Not, you know, I don't have it because I want to gloat, I don't have it because I need to look bigger than I am. I I want to just have it for my own personal experience, and then I want to share it with other people. And it's like life's so short, like, why not have fun? And so then they're like, okay, how'd you get it? Tell me more, blah, blah, blah. So it was almost like the gateway to like have the barretta entry lowered to be able to speak some truth into these young, maybe inspiring entrepreneurs. Like one guy works at AutoShop, other guy does something else, and then they both wanted to talk about how they potentially can maybe like help us lift off with sales or whatever the case may be. And whatever, you know, they're excited, emotions were running high. I sent them over my calendar link. Neither of them showed up. That's nor here nor there. So obviously that's not gonna work out, but but it was just so cool in the moment to be able to, and then he wanted to like sit in the car and said, Can I turn it on? I'm like, and I joke with him. I said, if you're gonna turn it on, you've got to bust out your camera and be like, Hey, I'm here in my Lamborghini, if you remember Ty Lopez, you know, and it was just like having fun with it. And so he did his own little video in there. And I think that there's something to be said about building a relationship, even if it's gonna be for a split second with someone, to inspire them to show them like it's possible. And like when I was growing up and saw like the GTR always go crazy about it and be like, oh, it was like a sign from God universe, call it what you will. I'm closer, like I'm closer to having it, just like it's on your desk, or you know, I'm sure you see it driving around the road and you're like, ah, I was here.

SPEAKER_01 15:06

100%. So you spend this time building an audience and creating connection and developing relationships. How do you turn those relationships into revenue?

SPEAKER_00 15:15

Very good question. So I think that the biggest thing is looking for alignment. So someone that like, because I've learned over the years as a business owner, is it's like when you first get started, you're like, yeah, I'll work with anyone and everyone. Like, I'm just trying to like say that I'm in business and yeah, I got the t-shirt, but I have no client, got a website, that means nothing. So being in alignment with people that are on the same page as you. So someone that is like maybe into cars or someone that's into fitness, and so then when you meet them, you can relate to them. And as you relate to them and then you can talk about cool stories with them, you have a sense of connection, and that connection then turns into an opportunity to transact with that person, and that person feels more comfortable and confident in wanting to work with you back to that story with like I'll just drop her name, Angela, who was in the studio a few weeks back. Like, we we were 11 years similarly in the business, but she's in the real estate side, and I'm in the real estate marketing side, and it was just alignment in so many different, in so many different ways. And so, this like, I don't know who you are, our podcast turned into like, I felt like I've known you forever. And there were so many similarities with the way that we uh articulate business, the way that we track things, and so it makes it so it's less of a headache when you can go deeper and be able to build those relationships. And it's a it's a nice door opening to build relationships when it comes to the car stuff, or it comes to going to going to events, and then of course, everyone wants to like you know follow you. So you have the Instagram handle, and every show you'll pick up another 10 or 15 followers, and then you'll get people posting your stuff and stories, and then their friend sees it, goes to your thing, and their uncle's a real estate professional, and then oh, I just closed the business from it without running any ads or anything. It was just me doing something in alignment. And I think that the biggest point with that is being in alignment of who you are truly and being connected with someone that is also in true alignment. That means like following your passions, your dreams, your aspirations, doing something that lights you up every single day so you don't really feel like you're working, and then organically it just comes together and you're like, wow, I just like picked up my biggest client of my life from like a car show or golfing or whatever the viewers and listeners love to do, and then being in their alignment and then being able to connect with someone and build that relationship.

SPEAKER_01 17:25

So the business is really kind of just like a byproduct of the relationships you develop through social. I'm fascinated by this because you're a guy that I've watched create a lot of content about real estate and technology, and you've been super niche to that. But it it sounds like, and maybe you can give us some clarity, that you're almost having more success by talking less about what you do and just more sharing experiences that you're having with really cool stuff.

SPEAKER_00 17:51

Yes, 100%. It's crazy how like you try so hard to specifically scream on the Marlin Tops about what you do and no one's listening. And then as soon as you say, okay, I'm over, I'm over it, I'm done. I'm just gonna focus on having fun. Um I'm just gonna go out to Fashion Square and just interview random people and ask them if they own or if they rent. And if they own, do they remember their agent's name and and and why do they pick that agent? If they rent, like why do they rent? And what do they need to see from content online for agents to potentially want to potentially use them? And so so it's interesting. Like, there is still that YouTube content that goes out and that short form content that goes out every single week. What I've learned is that after you build the relationship from doing fun stuff, and then they get into the ecosystem, they sign up, then you can drip them on the email marketing campaigns, you can send the long form video on YouTube, and they can see basically ways to maximize their website, buy a page, sell a page, maps, guides, what have you. And then it like connects because like I had a couple agents that are like, Hey, it's 2026, you know, I would love to be able to get like I want to get recalibrated for the year, this and that. And then they're like, Yeah, I watch every single one of your YouTube videos, I love it. I'm like 250 videos down. I was doing two a week, now I'm doing one a week, and I was like, Okay, well, you never commented, you never said anything, but I guess you watch all these videos, so I'm like, that's super. For something like, can you help me with the algorithm, please? So, so it's one of those things where it's just like for us, we're doing things untraditionally because I haven't even scaled the sales department just yet because we don't know what we don't know because of the way that we're we're we're building an organization of relationship building first from this passive prospecting and being a mayor of your town and what that looks like. And I think that with technology and AI and the right team and systems and processes, like that can then it could be all automated. It could be just you filter them through the funnel, it could be automated, and then there's videos, and there's so much you could do. And of course, there's still that human touch opportunity, but um, but for us to have customers that I mean, I just met a customer last week who's been with us for five years. We have like a 90% retention rate of our customers, and they don't they stick with us for a long time just because we have such a high level of a relationship that we build, and because they're in alignment and because I'm unapologetically me and I post so much online, people are like, all right, like I see exactly what Norm's doing and why he's doing it, how he's doing it, and all the things, and it builds confidence, and then now we are scaling our customer success side and just got out of that meeting before this pod, and and so now we're gonna go deeper with our current client set to make sure they can start rampant scale and have more success in the process.

SPEAKER_01 20:36

How have you found that you can have a relationship with so many clients at one time? Is it is social the secret there too, or is it a lot of one-to-one outreach?

SPEAKER_00 20:44

Yeah, I would say social is a big part of it, and then just doing the best you can. So, like I use social media and my wife's funny. She's like, Yeah, I just did a video and yada yada yada, and it was like lunch break today, and she's like, Did you watch that live that I did? I'm like, sorry, I didn't watch it yet. I will and I love you and I support you. I didn't watch it yet. And then I was just like, you look at like who you follow, and I I am perp I purposely follow like say the lift off experience. I only follow our guests. So when I'm going through the activity feed, it's our guests, or if someone wants to watch the pod, they see just the followers we follow as the pod guests, so they can easily follow them back. If I'm on Facebook or if I'm on, say, Instagram and I'm going through the activity feed, like for our Instagram page for liftoff, I like to do the best I can to share as much of our client's stuff onto our stories so they see that we see them. And then we've had people reach out to me personally, had a guy reach out to me right now or before our pod and ask me some questions about a coach that we're working with and if we partnered yet, and I just I message them back, like, hey, it hasn't happened yet. This is what's going on. So I think posting consistently has your customers feel more connected to you. And then when it's their birthday or their kids' birthdays, and you can quickly just say, Happy birthday, hope all's well, whatever the case may be. Or they see your YouTube video or they see the email marketing campaign, it's just enough. So you're not one of those CEOs out there that just kind of like lets the company run and then you kind of like fall behind the wait side. Like if you were to ask me who's the CEO of Luxury Presents or Agent Image or Real Geeks, like I couldn't tell you. Uh Agent Fire, I could, because he reached out to me personally and wanted to pick our brain, and that company is the closest to our company. But yeah, so that's that's kind of, I guess, the recipe to the success that I've had with the process.

SPEAKER_01 22:29

Would you say that, like, are you seeing that there's you know a higher value to being almost like more entertaining today socially? Are you drawing any like correlation there with the the cars and stuff like that? And and like the random interviews of people at the mall and stuff like that. There's more of an entertainment value to what you're doing?

SPEAKER_00 22:46

Yeah, it's entertaining and it's and it's this simple stuff. It's honestly it's so stupid, but it's like it's like the point and shoot 15 to 20 second thing that like takes off. I was like, I was gonna go meet with one of our clients. They have it's a random story, but they have a brokerage and they have a liquor store, and they own both. And the liquor store is right next to the brokerage, and so I'm gonna go meet Edgar and random story, gonna go meet Edgar, and I'm driving the GTR because I thought I was gonna pick him up, we're gonna go take lunch. And so he's with his wife, and that didn't happen. Long story short, guy's behind me, and he's out the window filming the GTR. So I'm filming him, film me. I just zoom in on the mirror, rearview mirror. I see him, and I just say, I see you, and then I launch off the light. It's 20 seconds long. That hit like 10,000, 15,000 views. Me just driving to meet with one of my clients, and then after I meet with one of my clients, he's hanging out, he takes me to his liquor stores, like, do you want, do you want to drink anything? And he's like, take whatever you want. It's like a movie, like, all right, sure, I'll have this drink, and then we're chit-chatting and talking, and it's just like this organic relationship where it's like, it's like I think we're we're missing the human element and the human touch. Because after VC funders and like these like multi-million and billion dollar organizations, it's like that's cool that you built this large organization, large company, and congratulations, and that's amazing. But like, how much meaningful, deep relationships or connections are you having? Because it's like you're just behind a desk making these executive decisions, your team in the front line, people are meeting everyone, and then you're totally just disengaged. And so I think that there's something to be said about that because you know, one day when liftoff gets sold for $300 million is the goal, and just to serve the top 1%, which is 15,000 agents, like I will probably carry on a lot of these relationships and they'll go into the next thing that I have already planned and manifest with this whole liftoff experience and what have you in the personal development coaching space that I will eventually go into after you know paying the bills and developing this marketing company.

SPEAKER_01 24:47

That's awesome, man. It's it sounds like it's like once you become interesting to people, then they become interested in what you do, and you're taking that and like parlaying it into the business where that's the revenue arm of what you're doing. So you're getting all this attention. And not everybody's gonna be interested in what you do, but like the the people that are like, Oh, I'm in real estate, oh I need a website, Norman's interesting, but they just go deeper and then you take that and then you so it's fascinating. Obviously, it works, it works very well. There's a lot of really cool people out there that are monetizing through a strategy like this, uh, but not everybody, not everybody does it at a high level, not everybody does it well. And it sounds like you guys have have kind of found your niche, which is awesome. Um this has been a fascinating conversation. I uh I really appreciate you spending some time. I have a lot more questions, but I want to respect your time. And of course I I think the last question I would ask is you know, how can we partner with you? How how can we as the listeners of the Partner Profit Podcast partner with you? What's important to you right now? How can we support your growth?

SPEAKER_00 25:43

Yeah, most definitely. I would say uh feedback is always welcome, and it's just at Mr. Liftoff. Go to my Instagram page and like there's my resume. See my family, see the cars, get a feel, go to my stories, you'll know exactly what I'm doing. My wife has a running joke. She's like, Where's Norm? Look at his stories. It's like it's like the running joke in our household. And then you can go to liftoff and you can go to the podcast that we have and all that type of stuff and see what we're up to and what we're doing. At the end of the day, we do have a referral partnership program. And so we pay anywhere from like seven, 14 up to 20% referral fee. That's how we're in a lot of basically programs with coaches to organically have referrals that come in because we basically run this company based off referrals. We don't run any ads, we don't do anything like a traditional business does because why be traditional when you could be different and fun with have fun with it? It's like gamify, I guess. So that yeah, that would be that'd be my whole thing and uh just keep it super simple. And I'm always available in the DMs, and so it might take a minute, but I'm always available.

SPEAKER_01 26:41

Love it, man. I appreciate you. I appreciate the shared experience here today. This was awesome. And I know I learned a few things that I I want to go play around with on my own socials and see see what can happen. We'll make sure that we link up all the ways that people can connect with you and partner with you in the comments or the show notes. And um if you're listening to this, I I highly encourage you to reach out to Norman. I've followed him for many years. Uh we've had numerous really high quality conversations, including today. And uh I know you will not be upset by interacting and engaging with him. Appreciate you again, Norman, for being here today.

SPEAKER_00 27:12

I appreciate you too, man. Thank you so much for your time today, and this has been amazing today.

SPEAKER_01 27:15

Yeah, yeah. And thank you all for continuing to listen to the Partner Profit podcast. We will see you on the next episode. Okay, peace.